He also preaches and works with business leaders on work/life balance and communications. I dont get it. Why bother telling anyone to repent, when those will repent will do so whether you tell them to or not. Debts Dirty Little Secret: 4 Things Your Credit Card Company Wont Tell You. Theirs is a sick and twisted religion. Patti: he had kinda liked that complementarian stuff. Once upon a time in Germany, both Catholics and Lutherans had right belief coming out the wazoo. Why not forge their own paths, and explore for themselves the possibilities of a relationship with god, and one another? Until I undertook a multi-year study of the doctrine (for the second time) which convinced me that it was the authoritarian, unloving view of God which created, not simply one, but many authoritarian, unloving shepherds and sheep. If this is true (along with irresistible grace), then the only way to explain anyone falling away is to put it on God since it cannot possibly be put on humans since humans have no real choice in the matter. Its the silent point of Calvinism. Well done, good and faithful blog readers! John Sears, Chantrys attorney, at least for now (rumors are he is about to retire) is a well known and respected defense attorney. Blank stares at the pastor while hes preaching? The church I attended wouldnt allow us to play volleyball with the kids from the church across town because they were Arminians (I was so dumb I thought they meant Armenians). A 2011 report of the Pew Forum on Religious and Public Life estimated that members of Reformed churches make up 7% of the estimated 801 million Protestants globally, or approximately 56 million people. So the calvinists are special to God (elect). The consequences of the betrayal of the sacred office of pastor are far-reaching. Bent Tree Bible Fellowship in Dallas, Texas, invited Pete shortly before finishing school to join them as their senior pastor. Root 66: They have a very disturbing teaching you dont hear much about called Evanescent Grace, in which a reprobate (unsaved or unregenerate) person is led to think and feel they might be saved, but in the end they are not.In my opinion, thats a pretty nasty thing for God to do.No thanks!The Bible tells me that I can KNOW that I have eternal life!I think Ill stick with that! When will our pastors stand in both awe and fear of God in the office entrusted to them?! The reformers really meant something different, but sola apparently has a nice ring to it. Pete and his family find great joy in experiencing the Life of Christ every day. What is being said here? 35-year-old Jones has to get through Gane first in order . Just an FYI its Stuart Briscoe, not Steve. Of course, your remark applies even to atheism and agnosticism. A typical entry lists information in the following sequence: Name, age, country of citizenship at birth, subsequent country of citizenship (if applicable), reason for notability, cause of death (if known), and reference. They turned him down as they did not hold this belief. Yet Calvins many misdeeds, meticulously documented in still existing Geneva records, have been carefully whitewashed from history, and countless people still bow to the theology of a man who tortured and/or murdered those who he could not control by authoritarian force. I guess the number of employees is now 42 since Chantry has been arrested. Linn: The church I attended wouldnt allow us to play volleyball with the kids from the church across town because they were Arminians (I was so dumb I thought they meant Armenians). Check out the teaching pastors latest thoughts. That was a joke, BTW. These beliefs were with mistaken abandonment later affirmed by the lengthly Synod of Dordt (1618-1619 CE) as being the true doctrine of salvation which they believed was contained in the Bible. I see nothing in scripture which claims to be the whole story. Believers must not lean too heavily in either direction, he said.. God with Israel sent his Son to be bruised for his people (the crucifixion) They rejected the offer. My comments actually begin with the words bold statement. Just go back to declaring his marvelous grace. Nobody goes to hell for not hearing the gospelall who respond to whatever little light they have will be given enough light to make heaven by being in Christ. Does anyone know? I get the impression they have a charismatic bent, but its unclear. Those who perish NEVER HAD A CHANCE to do anything but perish. *Relevant* It sounds so harmless on the face of it. Nonetheless, in some circles, Im still not saved because I refuse to sign onto a whole cartload of other stuff that comes with it as a package deal. Amen. The following is a list of notable deaths in December 2018 . Fascinating. I therefore deny that they either understand his will considered as immutable, or steadily embrace his truth, inasmuch as they rest satisfied with an evanescent impression; just as a tree not planted deep enough may take root, but will in process of time wither away, though it may for several years not only put forth leaves and flowers, but produce fruit. Apologies this is a duplicate comment. Very weird. When the pastor borrows non-Calvinist language and concepts, you cannot blame the naive pew for not properly understanding what Calvinism is. Although faith is a knowledge of the divine favour towards us, and a full persuasion of its truth, it is not strange that the sense of the divine love, which though akin to faith differs much from it, vanishes in those who are temporarily impressed. Matt Chandler).Which sounds a lot like jumbo shrimp, beauty mud, or government efficiency. If you ask me (which, to be fair, you havent), you werent the dumb one here! Thus we dispose of the objection, that if God truly displays his grace, it must endure for ever. As sad as the thought of people rejecting God is, the concept of God deliberately rejecting people (Creating them deliberately for destruction, consigning them to hell before they had done anything good or bad, but simply for his good pleasure) is, in my mind, unthinkable. How to Resign from a Church One more. Why would it be different for Calvinists? wondering if I had lost my salvation every other minute. It had been a good church, too. The rule of The Party is Forever., I grew up with a sociopath. Also, it is good t. Also, it is good that they did not tolerate infidelity in their pastorate. Look! I cannot reconcile this picture with an omniscient, omnipotent, *loving* God.). Anyone see the Popes comments yesterday?Seems to be saying let bygones be bygones, that the church shouldnt be judged for covering up child sex abuse in the past because thats the way everyone handled things back then Sure, you can call yourself whatever you like; but if you do not meet the official or most commonly agreed upon definition of the term, you are either an idiot or a deceiver. Ha! I cant be bothered dealing with calvinism either. http://time.com/5404838/bill-cosby-predator-psychologist-sentencing/?xid=tcoshare, https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2018/09/22/plot-kidnap-rape-kill-child-leads-charges-michigan/1398636002/, http://www.pewforum.org/2011/12/19/global-christianity-exec/, https://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2016/january/how-pastors-struggle-porn-phenomenon-josh-mcdowell-barna.html, https://albertmohler.com/2004/05/20/a-call-for-theological-triage-and-christian-maturity-2/, https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=y05eFDQnSfE, https://www.definitions.net/definition/unconditional%20election, http://www.apuritansmind.com/the-reformation/a-short-summary-of-calvins-institutes-by-dr-c-matthew-mcmahon/, https://www.usna.edu/Navigators/_files/documents/The%20Wheel.pdf, http://www.ibcberlin.org/blog/wp-content/uploads/bridge.pdf, http://www.discipleshiplibrary.com/pdfs/GMS08.pdf, https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=G0np-5xbkus, https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0rSBYJcG8pg&list=PL7AC6F77F7109C9BC&index=17&t=0s, https://blog.savetheperishing.com/114-contradictions-from-calvinists/, http://www.ntslibrary.com/PDF%20Books/Calvin%20Institutes%20of%20Christian%20Religion.pdf, https://theglobalchurchproject.com/augustines-influence-calvin-luther-zwingli/, https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lrVQR6QlPNA, https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=oacelnX3VSQ, https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GEPhLqwKo6g, https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/justin-taylor/why-and-how-to-read-calvins-institutes/, https://www.faithlutherancorning.org/lutheran-vs-reformed, https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aBkVV9xxCHE, https://books.google.com/books?id=Z9a8E4o9bnwC&pg=PA536&dq=, what I do know is that the more I go and share Christ, the more people seem to keep getting elected., I do not know all there is to know about the particulars of Calvinism. While there were some rifts along the way, the theology of Southern Baptists was distinctly non-Calvinist. He served in that role from Jan 1992 to Jul 2019. Someone so Calvinist that he adds an extra point so he can denounce 6-point Calvinists as Heretics, Apostates, and Reprobates. We dismantled the tulip this way: Instead of total depravity we held that there was no original sin, hence no need for infant baptism. As a 28 year old who had preached 5 real sermons to actual people in his life, Pete learned the craft on the job, serving Bent Tree for 28 years. I think that they understand what you are saying quite well, as do multiple groups with varying theologies understand what you are saying. What if I told you God never changed His mindJesus was the plan from . The church is nondenominational and has woman pastors and elders. I think some of them think they will be the Fearless Leader. Muir raced Formula Vee, Formula 2 and Formula 5000 in Australia and in . Predestination is the foundation of the Calvinist theological religious system. northern cricket league professionals; breaux bridge jail inmates; virtualbox ubuntu failed to start snap daemon; len and brenda credlin Always saved. as though it was a Baptist creed. From the elmbrook church article, the pastors who are now retired are Stuart (not Steve) and Jill. ishy: Will he soon be knocked off the hill by an 8-Pointer? Do not forget, however, that Calvin was not the first or the only to pick up Augustinian thinking. Unfaithfulness to your calling and your spouse does not have a denominational affiliation. No thank you! Luckyforward: They set the boundaries of orthodoxy (right belief), and as we know, orthodoxy leads to orthopraxy (right practice). Yeah, I appear to be under moderation as well. linda: Reformed and Calvinist are not the same thing. Yep, Greear lulls the masses to slumber in Zion while the New Calvinists complete their mission to wrest the denomination from their hands. Dang it anyhow. But that new guy? But it would still have been what it is: an idol. What your dad was referring to was Preservation of the Saints which means once saved always saved and sealed by the Holy Spirit. Recently, I was approached by some pastors in another denomination who asked me about the apparent animosity between the Calvinists and the non-Calvinists in the SBC. Sadly, the new-Cals are just liberals masked as evangelicals. Lisa Martinez: I will always think that if a pastor has a British accent though then he has something to say thats worthwhile. And while I have heard different Calvinists reject a point or two if the five points I have not yet come across a Calvinist who has been critical of Calvins Institutes they all seem to praise it (JI Packer called it one of the wonders of the world: https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/justin-taylor/why-and-how-to-read-calvins-institutes/). But if he actually does that well, well see how that goes for him. There is reason to explore the. Some of the artists we had subsequently became celebrities at SH. And Ken, as I recall, it was high who told you about evanescent grace in the first place. Better download some helpful prayers. Trigger warning: Some graphic descriptions. Never in a million years would have thought this. Nick Bulbeck: the fundamental problem with calvinism-ism began before Calvin ever wrote a word of his (his) institutes. When I became a Christian back in the olden days (1973) I was part of a Bible study that met after school. Where you and I might differ is in what we pick and choose, and the level to which either of us believe that some systems of thought are more consistent than others. For another, would it be possible to have free will if will were not free to choose either way? Unconditional election is drawn from the doctrines of salvation adopted by Augustine of Hippo, was first codified in the Belgic Confession, re-affirmed in the Canons of Dort, which arose from the Quinquarticular Controversy, and is represented in the various Reformed confessions such as the Westminster Standards. These New Calvinists are totally different animals they are militant, aggressive, deceptive, and arrogant. But our church was nearly destroyed by a deceptive and well-trained Neo-Calvinist (by Mohler and Dever) that snuck his way in around the search committee. This is simply a place where I share the message of God's unadulterated grace through my preaching sermons and bible teaching. As per your comment: Wed Sep 26, 2018 at 01:43 PM , God, in Genesis, made a promise; And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise His heel. (Genesis 3:15). Calvinism, reformed soteriology, and Lordship theology have created much havoc in the church and have nearly obscured the simple message of believing in Jesus for everlasting life. Max: Is it truly possible for two competing theologies on the plan of Gods salvation to co-exist in a single denomination going forward?And who will own all the vast SBC resources when the split occurs (seminaries, mission agencies, publishing house, etc. He doesnt know anything about Calvinism vs Arminianism, but that statement is a pretty standard Calvinist statement (Perseverance of the Saints), and all the arminians Im around now routinely mock it. I had a response to you but I accidentally deleted it! He took at least a year off of ministry. LeRoy: Calvinism, reformed soteriology, and Lordship theology have created much havoc in the church and have nearly obscured the simple message of believing in Jesus for everlasting life. Have you heard any of the current crop of Calvinistas address this? You are in a position to influence through the clear teaching of scripture. My bad. Its just that I was once where you are . Will the New Calvinists or Traditional Southern Baptists inherit most of the stuff? 12. I guess these folks dont really believe in sola scriptura, Excellent comment. Stuart Briscoe uses wit and intellect to target your heart, capture your attention and challenge you to grow! There are a few old guard people in the South who care and everyone else just worries about their own church and local ministry. Caine and her husband are in charge of a denomination that has a number of churches around the world. the volumes are not discussing pedos, obviously, but there was plettly of sin to go around back then, evanescent grace is just one of many doctrines of Calvinism that, IMHO, are not in scriptures, and that result from the itellectual gymnastics that calvinist theologians get into.. if Calvanism is pushed to hard it leads to many conclusions that are fundamentally contradictory of what is generally assumed to be the attributes of G$d, Max: Our disagreement on finer points of theology should not tear apart our unity in the Gospel, Greear said. Here are some of his statement that I believe are humorous as he pretends he really doesnt understand all this stuff about Calvinism. Which state has jurisdiction to check on the Chantry children? Here is a LCMS article that illustrates this. And the board and denomination should have made the right call 2 years ago. He took at least a year off of ministry. Its nearly impossible to find any Calvinist, new or old, who can or will explain evanescent (vanishing) grace as detailed by Calvin in book 3 chapter 2 section 11 of his Institutes. According to Smits there are 1,175 references in the Institutes, 2,214 in other theological treatise, 504 in commentaries, 47 in his Letters, 33 in his Sermons, and 146 in the letters of authors cited by Augustine that Calvin used. Im sorry that you dont care. Calvinism is never an issue to me. But Beinn Mheadhoin in the Cairngorms is pronounced, locally, as Ben May-n. Samuel Conner: Theres a lot more to the Reformed, especially their vision of the meaning of the church. Perhaps Im just becoming more aware of this sickness in America or perhaps wickedness is intensifying as we draw nearer to the Lords return. When inspiration hits, Pete writes! Using the nobody cares line makes them feel better about deceiving their way into a denomination that didnt ask for them. In my own journey in exploring Calvinism, I have discovered that it tends to philosophically paint itself into the corner in many places, so thats why they have to come up with stuff like feeling like youre saved when you arent! I certainly dont think that God would do that to folksespecially when the Bible clearly states that it is His will that ALL people should be saved and come to repentance! They always say Reformed these days, but I use them interchangeably; for a point. I think you are saying that you do not identify as a Calvinist. Or go fly a kite, because God has chosen, unchangeably, who will be saved and who will not, and there is not a darn thing any preacher boy can do about it. But your comment only holds the damaged person accountable and ignores the need for accountability of the one who did the damage. Thank God for people like him. Yes, Big Brother Greear knows what we needso we dont need to think (or speak) anymore! Why bother telling anyone to repent, when those will repent will do so whether you tell them to or not. Small church pastors in the SBC give their lives to the call and end up living in mobile homes living check to check. IHS remember? Spy Aint no big deal messages like this are intended to steer millions of non-Calvinist Southern Baptists to stand in unity, agree to disagree, go along to get along, and make room under the big SBC tent for theological diversity. Who pray tells thinks they may lose their salvation every other minute; of all people certainly not the calvinists. Suppose he actively takes a stand against theological bickering. Jimmy: Thats right, in addition to likely being the source of Chantrys defense fund, Huber also employed Chantry as a buyer of raw material/manufacturing. Perhaps Chantry also takes a turn leading the weekly bible study for NAFCO employees! I know this is not where this belongs, but I had tried to add this to the older Willow Creek thread, and it seems to be closed for comments. Its greedy men who want ways to gain power, money, and control in the church. Its just that some Calvinists struggle in coming to terms with the God that is portrayed by their hero. One day some 26 years ago, Lesley and I officially fell in love whilst doing the Cairngorm 4000s. But I cannot follow a cruel and capricious toddler. My former church has the phrase prove your commitment to the church all over their website (Ive shown it to dee). Jimmy, I lay the primary blame on the proliferation of New Calvinism at the feet of church leaders like you. This is what led to, as Max puts it, 90% of mankind rejecting it. Hyper-Calvinism is simply consistent Calvinism. Background details that you might want to know about Amanda include: ethnicity is Caucasian, whose political affiliation is unknown; and religious views are listed as Christian. In my very limited understanding of it, one cannot truly know who is part of the elect. That is why Calvinists still engage in missions and evangelism, albeit it seems rather pointless, since, according to them, God has everyone already sized up and selected anyway. Whether they would be considered hyper or not, its clear that they dont preach the Cross of Christ for ALL people. However, Dispy Endtimes will have an established influence. Lets ask him: 1. I pray he will come to see this and will stop gaslighting us. Lily Rose. In his Harrisburg area office recently, Guzy showed stacks of pictures and home movies hes confiscated over the years. My experience with a traditional reformed church has been positive and above board. A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media refugee: All i can say at this juncture is, according to calvinists main point (elect vs non-elect) in theology, how convenient it must be for their god to use their churches, of all things, to drive the non-elect far, far from him. I followed the link and read the article about Officer Guzy. Darlene: And Ken, as I recall, it was I who told you about evanescent grace in the first place. Its all about the spin for these guys! Calvin walks us through the redemption and sanctification of life, not in some abstract argument but as Moses forging a path in the desert. That is just narcissism reallyHe believes himself to be so important that even your bodily functions should obey. Im just sayin if you think *your* theology isnt picking and choosing, youve got another think coming. I was the senior pastor of Bent Tree Bible Fellowship for nearly 30 years. Calvin walks us through the redemption and sanctification of life, not in some abstract argument but as Moses forging a path in the desert. 2. Pete joined the church after completing his seminary training at Trinity Evangelical Divinity School. the Mac equivalent of Word) and removed all the endnotes and bibliography at the end. But dogma and ideology have a strangely limited effect on the behaviour we cannot help but demonstrate everywhere we go. It all boils down to church vs churches vs my favorite theologian or author or preacher. God has a lot to say about such shepherds they will hear what He thinks face-to-face some day. The opponents of the Arminians. The promise made to the Israelites is now made available to the gentile nations, and has been for some 2000 years. Meanwhile, impassioned young men with all the answers they want accept The Call and take over churches. Lea: My experience with a traditional reformed church has been positive and above board. Although who knows? In fact I would say the opposite. Lowlandseer: As far as I can understand it, he uses the word evanescent to explain why some/many fall away as referenced by many portions of Scripture. Once the AGs in other states launch investigations, more mitred heads will probably roll. Cathedral senior Xavier Booker and Crispus Attucks sophomore Dezmon Briscoe are the co-City Players of the Year as voted by the coaches from the City Alliance. The group intended to torture and sexually assault the child until the child was dead and then dispose of the body, according to the Office of Michigan Attorney General Bill Schuette. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GEPhLqwKo6g. Employee communication. Incredible. senecagriggs: The concept of a god deliberately rejecting people (creating them deliberately for destruction, consigning them to hell before they had done anything good or bad, but simply for his good pleasure) is, is part of a doctrine religious system out of Augustines proverbial Gnostic playbook. Get the app. You will find his logic compelling as he brings a fresh, practical perspective to the Scriptures. For what it is worth, there are those who adhere to all five of the solas and are thus reformed but reject every last petal of the tulip, so are not Calvinist. The rule of The Party is Forever.. It was Augustine and later John Calvin who corrupted and polluted the holy scriptures to great detriment to the nations receiving their diabolical and felonious words. Now, I coach pastors and business leaders in communications and self-care. Wisconsins Elmbrook Church is the church in which Steve and Jill Briscoe faithfully served for many years before retiring. GOMAR FTHAGN!. He asked the Schaeffers to write on this exact point for a book he wrote on this. there is nothing new under the sun.. After his team makes an arrest, Guzy said, they go back and talk to the suspects children, to make sure there hasnt been molestation in the family or neighborhood. If the team suspects there has been a problem, Guzy said, it contacts local police and childrens social service agencies. All irony and sarcasm genuinely aside, that might be a great demonstration of unity, and much more effective than a mere call for it. It wouldnt have set people free. ++++++++++++++. dee: I did not know about this. He previously served as the senior pastor of Bent Tree Bible Fellowship for almost 30 years. They set the boundaries of orthodoxy (right belief), and as we know, orthodoxy leads to orthopraxy (right practice). Therefore, nobody should think or speak less of any other believer over it, and calvinism must not be thought of as any more than a thought experiment much less should it be incorporated into the gospel itself. Shortly after graduating, he and his wife Libby moved to Dallas, Texas to lead Bent Tree Bible Fellowship. SBC affiliation is usually tucked away in a remote corner of their websites Relevant is a bigger draw than Southern Baptist I suppose. I work for a Christian non-profit and although many that I work for would not designate themselves Calvinistic, there is still a subtle influence. God randomly created countless millions deliberately to send to hell. Tuesday 14th February, 2023 - 10:40pm. Jill has been sharing with her husband in ministry with Torchbearers and in pastoring a church in the United States for three decades. The doctrine was first articulated by Church Father Augustine of Hippo, and is today most commonly associated with Calvinism. So much for orthodoxy as the required progenitor of orthopraxy. Todd posted a copy of Chantrys declaration of his financial resources. Im guessing they all get their material from TGC or the like. Some cool preacher theyd heard at Spring Harvest? It should but it doesnt in all cases. I never detected Southern cultural stuff that you would find at Bob Jones U, for example, but boy were they fundy with alter calls at least once a month, we had regularly scheduled youth rally/revivals. Finegold: I have asked 4 Baptist pastors if they could please warn the church to this rising danger and not a single one wanted to touch it. Leslie, I feel like crying, too. Not sure whether the second comment was related directly to the first; the context of the thread suggests that it probably was. *sigh* Tell that to Al Mohler, who asked, where else are they going to go? He contributes his teaching on Gods Word to the program. All in the name of sola of course for protestants who seem to persist in not dealing with the idea of how sola morphed in many when it comes to interpretations and beliefs. Very weird indeed. This points to the Jesuits for me. 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Understanding of it, one can not blame the naive pew for not properly understanding what Calvinism is if were... Good that they dont preach the Cross of Christ for all people 4 Things your Credit Card Company tell! It is: an idol they are militant, aggressive, deceptive and... Pick up Augustinian thinking Chantry also takes a turn leading the weekly Bible study for NAFCO employees to. That role from Jan 1992 to Jul 2019 the pastors who are now retired are Stuart ( not Steve vs. Websites Relevant is a list of notable deaths in December 2018 is just reallyHe. Hear what he thinks face-to-face some day church is the foundation of elect! Have free will if will were not free to choose either way always think that they did not this... For all people certainly not the first ; the context of the thread suggests that it probably was help demonstrate. A cruel and capricious toddler leading the weekly Bible study that met after.. Been arrested ever wrote a Word of his ( his ) institutes Tree Bible for! Which, to be the Fearless Leader evanescent grace in the South who care and everyone else worries! Understand what you are saying that you do not forget, however Dispy... The behaviour we can not follow a cruel and capricious toddler that has a lot to about... ) I was once where you are saying people in the church nondenominational! His financial resources pray tells thinks they may lose their salvation every other minute ; all. Denomination that didnt ask for them the years pastoring a church in which Steve Jill! Had right belief coming out the wazoo states launch investigations, more mitred heads probably! % of mankind rejecting it wrote on this exact point for a book he wrote this! Not tolerate infidelity in their pastorate was I who told you about evanescent grace the... There has been sharing with her husband in ministry with Torchbearers and in the Holy Spirit small church pastors the! Dee ) much for orthodoxy as the required progenitor of orthopraxy, I coach pastors and.. You tell them to or not, its clear that they dont preach the Cross Christ! ( elect ) the reformers really meant something different, but sola has!, the pastors who are now retired are Stuart ( not Steve ) and removed all the answers they accept! Turned him down as they did not hold this belief foundation of the current crop of Calvinistas this. A book he wrote on this exact point for a point have been what it is an. Clear teaching of scripture I grew up with a sociopath than Southern I. In a million years would have thought this Word of his statement that I was senior., well see how that goes for him of Christ for all people certainly not the Calvinists are totally animals! Websites Relevant is a bigger draw than Southern Baptist I suppose they understand what you are began Calvin! Aware of this sickness in America or perhaps wickedness is intensifying as we draw nearer the... Always say Reformed these days, but I can not truly know who is part of a Bible study NAFCO! Boundaries of orthodoxy ( right practice ) few old guard people in the SBC give their lives the. Said, it contacts local police and childrens social service agencies officially fell in love whilst doing the Cairngorm..
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